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01/19/07 23:21
Modified:
  01/19/07 23:22

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#131149 - Why focus on smoke? Have you missed the point?
Responding to: ???'s previous message
Jan,

The problem is not with destruction of parts on the board. It's with the fact that when you solder a high-pin-count part on the board, one with a fine pitch, you not only waste that part if it doesn't function, but it causes waste of the other parts, e.g. the $2000 FPGA, that are also soldered onto the board.

Passives are not likely to be different from one end of the tape to the other, so test a few at one end and you probably have a picture of what they've shipped you. If they're mislabelled, it will show up immediately.

Distributors are prone to ship you another customer's rejects, though. It's easy and nobody will notice if you don't inspect them right away.

I have examples of boards not a half-meter square that have 2500 passives and 400 or so actives on them, parts being placed on both sides of the board. The one I'm thinking of was very costly, with several multi-hundred-dollar XILINX FPGA's on it and a couple of pretty expensive microprocessors, too, not to mention considerable memory, which was very costly back then, and most of that hardware was soldered in place rather than socketed. Back then, one could desolder a part and replace it without much ado, though it did cost half a day's work for an experienced technician. If you have CS/BGA packaged parts, though, and most of the really low-priced ones are, you don't have access to all the pins. You can remove the, say, 1148-ball FPGA, but then have to have it reballed in order to reuse it, and, of course, it's not alone ... there may be other parts that cost quite a bit too. Some of the boards I've seen as FPGA demo boards cost $50000. If there's a non-functional MCU, with critical functions on which the circuit relies, over in the corner, it makes that entire board useless. That's the problem I'm trying to avoid. When circuits cost that much in units, you don't want to have to repair them. First, of course, because it is costly to rework a high-density board, and secondly because it's damaging to your reputation if your $50K board doesn't work where your customer can see it. If you're smart, of course, there's thorough OUTGOING inspection, too, so at least your customers don't see the boards that don't work. However, you'll probably invest man-days in isolating the fault and even more in repairing it. Incoming inspection, particularly if it's random, is much less costly, as it can be planned and will have little impact on schedule and budget.

Incoming inspection of simple passives and linears isn't a problem, but as the complexity of digital components increases, it's important to know BEFORE THEY'RE SOLDERED IN PLACE, that they're fully functional.

RE

List of 53 messages in thread
TopicAuthorDate
805x system self-test            01/01/70 00:00      
   erk            01/01/70 00:00      
      Well ... it seems to me ...            01/01/70 00:00      
         Not That            01/01/70 00:00      
            Clearly if the CPU is knackered            01/01/70 00:00      
               If you have a new lot of parts ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                  depending on application...            01/01/70 00:00      
                     let me reframe the question ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                        do you want to do the manufacturer's job?            01/01/70 00:00      
                           don't get me wrong            01/01/70 00:00      
                           No, it's not his job ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                  OF COURSE you do            01/01/70 00:00      
                     I don't know which disty's you do biz with ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                        why? what? when? how?            01/01/70 00:00      
                           Where you sit determines what you see.            01/01/70 00:00      
                              not at all            01/01/70 00:00      
                              RC reset            01/01/70 00:00      
                                 on testing            01/01/70 00:00      
                                    re smoke - I just realize            01/01/70 00:00      
                                       5 Volts can produce smoke            01/01/70 00:00      
                                    Why focus on smoke? Have you missed the point?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                 nope ... not that simple            01/01/70 00:00      
                                    but it sounds exactly so...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                       I've tried a MAX1232 ... is that good enough?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                          pushbutton reset            01/01/70 00:00      
                                             pushbutton            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                I don't understand            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                   NO!            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                      some options            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                         That' not exactly the case ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                            weird parts            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                               Too bad I didn\'t know about your interest earlier            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                  your test subjects.... :-)            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                     under other circumstances ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                           Jan, I think you missed the point            01/01/70 00:00      
                        OH            01/01/70 00:00      
                           Digikey and Mouser aren't "normal" disty's            01/01/70 00:00      
                              You have a very low opinion of distributors, is th            01/01/70 00:00      
                                 Yes I do ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                    nope            01/01/70 00:00      
               If you have a new lot of parts ...            01/01/70 00:00      
   Your test program            01/01/70 00:00      
      waitaminute ... I didn't say I'd written it ...            01/01/70 00:00      
         Well...            01/01/70 00:00      
            never used a '320.            01/01/70 00:00      
               So...            01/01/70 00:00      
                  I\'ve built 805x stuff since the \'70\'s ...            01/01/70 00:00      
            aackk! it double-posted again            01/01/70 00:00      
   a real example            01/01/70 00:00      
      Testing 8051s            01/01/70 00:00      
         I'm just out to find stuff that's "broken"            01/01/70 00:00      
         how did you come to that figure?            01/01/70 00:00      
            Fault coverage figure            01/01/70 00:00      

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