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???
02/10/07 22:11
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#132489 - not that fast, Kai
Responding to: ???'s previous message
Daniel said:
I had to use another xtal for a PLL

Kai Klaas said:
It's never a good idea to use the ALE signal for anything else than it's originally designed for, namely as address latch enable signal.

Both the "bible" and the said datasheet SUGGEST that ALE may be used as a clock output.

Daniel said:
- With little spikes in Vcc (500mVpp)(I know, they should not be there!) AND low temperature, the AT89S8253 is unable to read eeprom in the very beginning of software execution.

Kai Klaas said:
It's very well known, that spikes on Vcc is deadly poison to all flash micros. By the way, 500mVpp is not at all little but huge!
That the AT89S8252 withstands this torture only tells, that the AT89S8252 is especially noise immune, but not that the AT89S8253 is bugy.


It IS buggy. The specs say, VCC should be within certain limits - and while it is within these limits it whouldn't matter what waveform it exactly is. If the specs would say anything on spectral purity of VCC, I'll shut up, but nothing like that is there.

Even if you are partially right that the application-maker should ensure nice and calm environment for the micro, the chipmaker should on the other hand make everything to make the chip running under any harsh circumstances - and at least make a decent documentation of what he did (and the chip should at least work within the specified limits). See Lynn Reed's approach to overdimensioning the 8255's outputs.

Kai, please, this chip IS proven to be a crap.

Look at AVRs and PICs. They are competition to '51s - and, although I don't like to tell it, they ARE competent. They might have a lot of errors and bugs but these are never getting worse with the newer versions - while this did!

JW


List of 83 messages in thread
TopicAuthorDate
Comments about AT89S8253            01/01/70 00:00      
   are you surprised, it's Atmel            01/01/70 00:00      
      are you surprised, it's Erik            01/01/70 00:00      
   Not neccessarily bugs...            01/01/70 00:00      
      AT89S8253 ALE pulses            01/01/70 00:00      
         Yes, a bit imprecise            01/01/70 00:00      
            And Vcc rise time...            01/01/70 00:00      
               What kind of "external reset"?            01/01/70 00:00      
      not that fast, Kai            01/01/70 00:00      
         Not so fast, Jan...            01/01/70 00:00      
            speaking from experience...            01/01/70 00:00      
               ...as engineer?            01/01/70 00:00      
               make that darn datasheet 5000 pages            01/01/70 00:00      
                  Exactly!            01/01/70 00:00      
                     I'm not sure what you mean, Kai            01/01/70 00:00      
                        That's what I meant            01/01/70 00:00      
                  Serial hung.            01/01/70 00:00      
            migration            01/01/70 00:00      
               Please quote carefully...            01/01/70 00:00      
         is it possible            01/01/70 00:00      
            I don't think so...            01/01/70 00:00      
   Any reset            01/01/70 00:00      
      I've wondered about this ...            01/01/70 00:00      
         Indeed!            01/01/70 00:00      
            Perhaps they're part of the problem ...            01/01/70 00:00      
               Do you think...            01/01/70 00:00      
                  That's not clear to me.            01/01/70 00:00      
               not here            01/01/70 00:00      
                  These are all COTS SMPS\'            01/01/70 00:00      
                     startup            01/01/70 00:00      
            Is it not instead a problem of letting reset go be            01/01/70 00:00      
               staring problem            01/01/70 00:00      
                  have you never stared at a problem :)            01/01/70 00:00      
                     Ah, so you meant....            01/01/70 00:00      
      What resets?            01/01/70 00:00      
         Any reset!            01/01/70 00:00      
            I got what you mean            01/01/70 00:00      
               Circuit proposed            01/01/70 00:00      
                  Interesting!            01/01/70 00:00      
         SMPS and LC filter            01/01/70 00:00      
            Switchers & low ESR            01/01/70 00:00      
               you missed the point            01/01/70 00:00      
                  What 100nF?            01/01/70 00:00      
            Rob is right            01/01/70 00:00      
               Ah            01/01/70 00:00      
                  Erik, you do use switchers frequently...            01/01/70 00:00      
                     nope, all I know is that they work and work and wo            01/01/70 00:00      
                        Thanks            01/01/70 00:00      
                           so ... Kai ... how would YOU build a power switch?            01/01/70 00:00      
                              there is no difference between "no power" and "in            01/01/70 00:00      
                                 There is a difference ... no power means no clock            01/01/70 00:00      
                                    ah, an investigatory measure            01/01/70 00:00      
                                       The Max1232 gets pretty confused ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                          what decoupling do you have across the supervisor            01/01/70 00:00      
                                             This was a Philips ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                Too fast?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                   The risetime isn\'t all that fast.            01/01/70 00:00      
                                          More details, please?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                             So far, it's just the reset that's been broken            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                Throw away the DS1232!!            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                   I\'ll have to send for a couple ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                      I've seen that one and it did not work            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                         Especially difficult to design            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                      Datasheets            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                      610msec reset active time of MAX1232 not enough?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                         Let's get to the bottom of it ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                            Some ideas...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                               each flash/eeprom HAS a charge pump...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                  Exactly, Jan!            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                               Yes, but ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                  Why there are reset issues            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                     so you're saying I should pull down ALE and nPSEN            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                        Real Reset            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                     be careful...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                     never heard of that one, can you elaborate            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                        Elaborations on Reset            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                           Mayabe that's worth some study ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                              Which chip are you using?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                 I can try several, but for now, Philips            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                   DS1232?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                      it means Dallas Semiconductor            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                   re 1232            01/01/70 00:00      
   Sorry.            01/01/70 00:00      

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