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???
02/16/06 17:07
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#110171 - it's that ASR33 rate that bugs me ...
Responding to: ???'s previous message
Erik,

There's an old military saying that, "Where you sit determines what you see."

Convenience determines cost, from where I sit, and I don't sit on an ivory tower where cost means nothing, but, since many of my applications have a maximum volume of 2 pieces, the man-hours involved in generating them are critical. If it's possible to use something that already exists, that saves on manpower. Also, the production cycle sometimes has to be very short, as short as two or three days from contract to delivery, in some cases, and quite often under a week.

Respinning PCB's, for example, involves risk. If I have boards made here in the U.S. I'm fortunate to have a 1% yield by the time they're assembled. That means that a board with $100 in total cost will cost as much as $10K just because of the low-quality manufacturing and assembly available here. Sadly, we don't take folks who show up intoxicated out back of the plant and shoot them in order to recover their salvagable organs for resale. The result is that we have to wait for a car crash if we need a liver transplant, while, in some parts of the world, they schedule them 4-5 days in advance.

I'm not high-volume enough, generally speaking, to justify having the boards made in China, where I'm almost certain to have a 100% yield. Unfortunately, if I have 'em made there, or in Korea, or in Taiwan, I'll have a competitor within a couple of weeks, who doesn't have the NRE to recover, if the volume is large enough to have 'em made there. Delivery from eastern Europe is too slow.

you say,
...It is NOT used bercause it is "sacred", it is used because it can generate 9600 - up which 12 can not. Today 22.1184 is gradually becoming the usual YES, "the usual" NOT "the sacred"...

but it's been shown in a couple of posts, perhaps even in this thread, that 12 can get within less than a percent of the required rate, and, of course, 12.288 MHz can hit it with 0% error.

you go on with,
"most of us do not live in an ivor tower where the cost of an external UART does not matter."

which I submit is pretty cheap when you're only building a couple.

and you say,
"where is the gain???????????? you get the same number of interrupts, you have to do the same processing whether you use an external or internal UART. "

to which I'd reply that the UART used for the debugging process probably doesn't need an interrupt at all, since the only program that uses it is the debug monitor. When it needs an interrupt, that one has to be chosen so it doesn't interfere with the target application. It mustn't use resources that the target might need.

You see, things look pretty different from our quite different situations. I think you get into the position of assuming that someone, anyone, doing something differently than you would do them is WRONG. I don't believe that. That's why I jump on you every time you tell someone they shouldn't use the i8255, though I wouldn't do it unless the thing were already on a board, or, that they should use your favorite MCU, which is seldom what the person making the inquiry wants to do. Now, I don't think disagreement is a bad thing in itself, as it reflects differring views of the situation. I find I get much valuable information from folks with opinions that differ from my own, but its value does depend on why it is that you disagree.

RE



List of 90 messages in thread
TopicAuthorDate
does anybody use those "low" baud rates?            01/01/70 00:00      
   I think            01/01/70 00:00      
      I use even low            01/01/70 00:00      
      but I want REAL information            01/01/70 00:00      
   OBDII            01/01/70 00:00      
      Interesting ... Was that standard ASYNC            01/01/70 00:00      
         srry here is the full story            01/01/70 00:00      
   Water level            01/01/70 00:00      
      Is that in ASYNC format?            01/01/70 00:00      
         why not 11.0592/22.1184MHz?            01/01/70 00:00      
            serial timing isn't always as important            01/01/70 00:00      
               comments            01/01/70 00:00      
                  Well ... that's not entirely true ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                     precise???            01/01/70 00:00      
                        Inconvenience            01/01/70 00:00      
                           IF there's another way ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                              forget mode 0, im that mode there is no            01/01/70 00:00      
                                 Not the ones I see ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                              again, why not 11.0592 ?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                 if you don't like the 11.0592MHz...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                    Well, if they do 24, why not use that?            01/01/70 00:00      
                                 I see your point, but ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                    Do I miss something??            01/01/70 00:00      
                                       Excitement? I'm not excited ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                          why do you keep stating "sacred", it is            01/01/70 00:00      
                                             Right Erik !            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                It's because of the purpose            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                   And if that is out of the question use            01/01/70 00:00      
                                             Still none the wiser            01/01/70 00:00      
                                             it's that ASR33 rate that bugs me ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                not the statements, the "universalism"            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                   Re: not the statements, the "universalis            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                      Yes, as I said, it's convenient ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                         if you use (as you yourself state to pre            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                            It's been shown            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                               Of course it is            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                  It's hard to argue ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                     Then buy it, or even better, have one on            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                        I'll buy 'em when there IS such a thing            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                           misapplied economy            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                              The $2 board was fully assembled            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                 again you talk about oranges            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                               Because reliability !            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                  Seems interesting ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                     only 24Mhz can be get            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                        True, for sure,            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                     apples and oranges            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                        If that's true, then something's broken            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                           a slight correction            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                              You're right, of course,            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                 actually you did            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                              further correction            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                 That's up to you ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                    I do not know where you get that impress            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                       One thing at a time ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                          no            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                             so you talk to that stuff directly            01/01/70 00:00      
                                                                                                as to "what I do"            01/01/70 00:00      
                        That's not quite true ...            01/01/70 00:00      
         8048?            01/01/70 00:00      
            You're right, it's not            01/01/70 00:00      
               have a look            01/01/70 00:00      
                  It's not obvious what you mean, Erik            01/01/70 00:00      
                     no, not that            01/01/70 00:00      
                        Close, perhaps, but no cigar ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                           SPI rather than I2C            01/01/70 00:00      
                              the full story            01/01/70 00:00      
                                 I2C, SPI, parallel, whatever            01/01/70 00:00      
                           poll a bit            01/01/70 00:00      
               '51 descendant of 8042            01/01/70 00:00      
                  The one on the KEIL page is too big ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                     CPLD            01/01/70 00:00      
                        I did sumfin like that            01/01/70 00:00      
   Specialist transmission only            01/01/70 00:00      
   EVA-DTS over DDCMP            01/01/70 00:00      
      simulator Fun            01/01/70 00:00      
   A "Why" for low speed modems            01/01/70 00:00      
   Low baud rate            01/01/70 00:00      
   Bill Acceptors            01/01/70 00:00      
      well ... clearly there are some places            01/01/70 00:00      
   doesn't ring true ...            01/01/70 00:00      
      which one?            01/01/70 00:00      
         here:            01/01/70 00:00      
            oh no            01/01/70 00:00      
               OK ... no big deal            01/01/70 00:00      
                  YES!, I would not even dream of driving            01/01/70 00:00      
                     Well, I did that            01/01/70 00:00      
                        not every application can "take a pause"            01/01/70 00:00      
                           Believe it or not, I agree ...            01/01/70 00:00      
                              wow            01/01/70 00:00      

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